My phone rang. It was an unknown number.
“Bonita here,” I greeted as I picked up the phone.
“Hi Bonita, this is Patricia!”
Patricia had been my college classmate back at college. We worked on our senior year project together, doing an operational and marketing project as a requirement for graduation. I have also not been in contact with her for the last 12 years, only managing to see her at Starbucks last year.
“Hi Patricia,” I answered. “How are you?”
“I know it’s been awhile since I’ve been in contact,” she said. “Do you have time to talk?”
“Sure, I have only a few minutes,” I said. “What’s up?”
“Yeah, it’s just that I thought about you recently and I wondered if it would be good to catch up? It’s just coincidental since I saw you last time in Starbucks and we go to CCF together,” she said. CCF stood for Christ’s Christian Fellowship, one of the largest and most aggressive Protestant church in Manila today.
“Sure, that would be nice,” I said.
“How about Monday or Wednesday?” she asked.
“I think Wednesday would be okay. 5:30pm?” I answered.
“Sure,” she said. “Wednesday it is then at 5:30 pm. At Starbucks where we last saw each other.”
I thought nothing of it then though found it weird when she texted me a confirmation of our meeting.
Hi Bonita! Patricia here. See you Wednesday next week, the 6th, 5:30 pm at Starbucks!
“Thanks and see you!” I replied.
As I was busy with work, I thought nothing of it until on Wednesday morning when she texted me to remind me about the meeting. People can be organized, and it was a breath of fresh air to people who are less so.
But when I saw her on Wednesday, I came out of the catch up a little bit disappointed. Why? For the following reasons:
1) She caught up with me not much that she wanted to know how I was, but instead, to tell me about a wonderful entrepreneurial opportunity that was available, which turned out to be Nu Skin.
After asking me about how I was after college, and how I met my husband, Patricia then shared with me that she was working for a group called Nu Skin, and how interesting it could be if I wanted to have more income.
“I know you’re an entrepreneur, Bonita.” she said. “My group Nu Skin offers you the opportunity to set up your own business, make additional income. Look at me, it’s enough for me to quit my job and do it full time.”
As an actual entrepreneur, I wondered what she meant. According to the Merriam Webster dictionary, an entrepreneur is “a person who organizes and operates a business or businesses, taking on greater than normal financial risks in order to do so.”
Personally, I feel that an entrepreneur develops the product or service, and sells it to somebody else. With Nu Skin, you are selling somebody else’s products and services. In my book, we call these people AGENTS, NOT an entrepreneur.
She then shared with me how multi-level marketing works: Basically, you recruit people — Nu Skin calls them distributors — and you ask them to sell Nu Skin products with you, with you the recruiter getting a cut on their sales.
The long compensation plan is detailed here: Nu Skin Compensation Plan.
If you have no patience to read the 5-page document, let me summarize it for you. To make the long story short, if you are successfully recruited as an Agent cum Distributor, you will get products at a whopping 30% discount. For any recruit you have at the first level, you will be given 10% commission for every sale they have. On the second to the sixth level, 5% commission.
It’s basically a pyramid scheme where you profit from people below you. Depending on how your recruits perform, your profit can reach “millions,” or so Patricia said if you’ve reached the Blue Diamond level.
Long story short, Nu Skin employs GREED to recruit people who can recruit people to sell their products. Not that there’s anything wrong with greed — as businesspeople work for money — but it becomes an issue when it’s not explained well that to get the money, you have to work hard. Products that are mostly for weight loss or for stem cell therapy, innovative products that they say works but require you to try out first all at cheap packages of at least Php 24,000 for a month, and Php 75,000 for a program. Their weight loss program for example lasts for 90 days and costs Php 75,000, 6.25x the monthly wage of an average Filipino.
Honestly, I felt a bit suckered. Even more so when I realized the whole meetup was a ploy to get me to listen to Nu Skin’s sales pitch.
I felt even worse when I came home and talked to Ben, my husband’s cousin, who was also a new Nu Skin recruit, and hence, was more forthcoming on the many sales strategies Nu Skin distributors employ to find new recruits.
Ben told me that distributors were provided a script on how to get people to meet up with Nu Skin agents.
“They give you a script which tells you how to word the call,” he shared. “First, you have to smile while making the call because people can hear your smile. Then you should keep the call short — less than 5 minutes — and the purpose of the call is to get the person to meet with you.”
“We aren’t allowed to say what organization we work for,” he said. “Just say ‘you’re part of a group’ and tell them you’d like to catch up. Then give them two options of date/time to meet up. Don’t ask them when they are free. Ask them a choice of two — Day 1 or Day 2. That way, they would most likely to say yes.”
I was dumbfounded as I heard Ben share with me what Nu Skin has been telling their agents. Basically, the whole catch up was to get me to meet up so they can talk about their organization!
“If Nu Skin wasn’t such a bad word,” my husband said, “Then why do they even advise their agents to NOT mention their organization’s name? If you were so proud of your company, why not let other people know until you’ve fallen into their trap?”
Good point.
I myself am proud of my own company, and I want all my other employees to be proud of their work too. I would never advise my staff to dodge the question on where they worked if asked.
It saddens me that my college friend cannot even declare where she worked until I was there having coffee in front of her.
“It’s to stop close minded people from judging you immediately,” Ben said.
Well, I can tell people where I worked and close-minded people will NOT judge me. So what does that make of Nu Skin?
2) The purpose of the meeting was to invite me to their talk in Octagon Building in Ortigas. And the talk was full of misleading marketing messages!
“One of our members, Mr. Dennis Ong, is giving a talk this Thursday,” Patricia invited me. “You should listen to him. He used to import PC hardware before computers became popular, and made a pretty buck. But now he’s doing Nu Skin and makes millions a month. As you can see, now that he’s a millionaire, he’s not doing this for money but instead because he likes what he does.”
The pitch is that Nu Skin provides you with passive income, a lot more money than if you’ve worked on a traditional brick and mortar business. Honestly, I was curious – I wanted to see what type of organization can get my college friend to ask long-lost friends out for coffee to share them wonderful opportunities to make even more money. I wanted to check out the organization that seems to have an ulterior motive in every step.
I attended the talk.
The talk first dealt with how Nu Skin Products were in the forefront of technology, with breakthrough products that help with anti-aging and weight loss. “You want to have a stable partner who can give you the products that works,” the speaker said. “With Nu Skin as a partner, you’ll have a low cost of entry and high profit potential as we can give you products you can sell, and people will need.”
I don’t have a problem with this. Personally, I believe that Nu Skin products aren’t bogus. You can’t be a listed company in the US if you market fake products. However, I do believe that the company misleads their recruits.
Case in point, at last Thursday’s presentation, they showed a Discovery Channel clip as an introduction to their product. The Discovery Channel showed how people were much worried about aging and many scientists were developing medicine to find the fountain of youth.
Here’s the clincher: The Discovery Channel segment did NOT even mention Nu Skin or its products! It merely talked about anti-aging and the search for the fountain of youth.
But immediately after the clip, the presenter showed a Flash presentation of Nu Skin’s anti-aging product. As if the two clips were one and the same, and the scientists of the Discovery Channel were endorsing Nu Skin and their products!
I was flabbergasted. This is truly misleading marketing!
Then Dennis Ong came in and talked about his background. He first started his talk saying he wasn’t in here for the money, and that he has more than enough to already live a comfortable life. But then he shared that he is a graduate of architecture and how he decided to go to business because architects don’t make a lot of money.
Wah, Nu Skin truly is a company full of conflicting statements. First you say you don’t care about money, then you tell me that Greed is good. Ano ba talaga, pare?
Then he talked about the principles of Robert Kiyosaki, author of Rich Dad Poor Dad. Paraphrasing Kiyosaki’s book and seemingly convincing everyone that these ideas were his own, he briefly talked about the principles of asset vs. liability, and how people should count on passive income if they want to be wealthy and retire before the age of 65.
While talking, I was observing how in a room of 70, half of the room consisted of old agents who would excitingly answer every one of Ong’s questions.
“Do you want to be rich?”
“YES!”
“Do you want to retire before the age of 65?”
“YES!”
I felt it was weird that the whole setup was like a semi brainwashing process. Put enough monkeys in the room, and the non-primates would think they’re monkeys too.
I also found it funny how new recruits were chaperoned to sit in front while their recruiters sat at the back. The whole set-up was to make more converts.
Personally, I felt Ong spewed a lot of financial common sense that was mostly taken from the book Rich Dad Poor Dad. Taken apart, it made sense, but if you really thought about it, a lot of the things Ong said was misleading.
For example, he stressed the importance of having passive income instead of just putting your money in the bank where it’s being killed slowly but surely by inflation. To have a passive income of Php 50,000-100,000, you have to have a savings account of Php 30 million. This is WRONG.
You would need more than Php 30million to get an income of Php 100,000. Bank rate for savings is just 1.25% per annum. So to get Php 100K monthly income, you’d need a savings account of Php 96 million!
Two, I don’t understand how passive income is related to multi-level marketing. Passive income makes you money night and day, non-stop. It’s like rent — once you lease out your place, your tenant gives you his monthly rent whether he likes it or not. Even if he doesn’t stay in the place, he still has to pay you. Same goes with borrowing money from the bank. Night or day, you still have to pay for the interest.
It’s radically different from multi-level marketing!
If people from your downline don’t work, you get no income if you stop working. You and the people below you would have to continuously work in order for you to get money. Once you and they stop, the money also stops. And once it stops, unlike property which you can sell at a capital gain, you are left with nothing except your savings.
This is not passive income, my dear. Which is why I am unsure why Ong would link passive income to a multi-level marketing scheme, except maybe to dupe more people in signing up.
Two, he also talked about how Nu Skin gave him financial freedom.Because Nu Skin can be done full or part-time, agents can control their own time.
“After I got married, my priorities shifted.” Ong shared. “All of a sudden, I wanted to stay with my family. Working hard for another corporation would not have given me the time or money to do what I want which is to spend time with family.”
This concept is once again true.
Working part- or flexi-time gives you more time for family and for other endeavors. But like any other job, you don’t work, you don’t eat. So how hard you work recruiting for Nu Skin will determine your income. The more you work, the more money you’ll have. So depending on how greedy you are, there is a big chance you’d be out schilling for Nu Skin products with your friends instead of spending time with your family!
Ong continues on and on about misleading principles on how to get rich and how Nu Skin might hold the key to being wealthy. The talk I think was 85% recruitment and 15% about the product!
Mercifully, we finally end the talk by spending the last 10 minutes talking about the three products Nu Skin is endorsing that day — The TR90 Weightloss Program, the R2 and the Galvanic Spa, all of which was sold at a cheap wholesale price of Php 68,000 to Php 77,500. But a starter kit would only cost you Php 24,000-30,000. Ong said for any questions, our distributor friends would talk to us more about these products, then signalling the end of the talk and the start of my one-on-one session with Patricia.
Again, I am amazed on how effective Nu Skin’s marketing can be. First, they bring you to the talk to fire up your greed, then funnel you back to your distributor/recruiter who will share with you how you too can be part of the Nu Skin family and make thousands and millions of bucks, depending on how you worked.
3) The one-on-one session invites you to buy Nu Skin products for yourself, or to recruit people you to know to buy the products.
“You have to use it so you can believe,” Patricia cajoled.
“I’m afraid I’m not your target market Pat,” I quipped pointing out to my 50 kilo frame. “I am not in need of weight loss, and I am too young for stem cell therapy of r2. My father has also blessed me with very good skin. I have never been to a dermatologist in my entire life and have no need for a Galvanic Spa kit.”
“But you know of people who can use it, no?”
“I do, but I don’t feel confident to offer them products as I am not a doctor,” I answered. Personally, I don’t like to offer or endorse products I have never used, or to do so for personal gain. It makes me feel as if I am using my connections for profit and I don’t feel very comfortable about that.
“If you can suggest to me 5 names of those who can potentially take advantage of these products…” Patricia said.
I then asked how many Blue Diamonds – the highest rank at Nu Skin – the Philippines has.
“15,” Patricia answered. “Dennis and his wife are two of them.”
I nodded my head. Nu Skin has been in the Philippines for the last 15 years. Dennis has been at Nu Skin for 15 years. As Blue Diamonds make Php 2.2 million per month, that gives the Ong family at least Php 4.4 million of income if the statistics were true.
“Dennis and his wife must be gazillionaires,” I laughed. “Why is he still working at Nu Skin?”
“Oh he stopped for three years because him and his wife wanted to make a baby,” Patricia explained. “But stopping, well, you know what it does… and yes, after AgeLoc came out, Dennis decided it was too good an opportunity to pass up.”
People work to have money. Once they have enough money, they stop. The Ong family, bless their heart, are more hardworking. Or just greedy. Maybe it’s both. My theory is, like what I’ve said, multi-level marketing is not really passive income so once you stop, money comes in trickles and you have to get back to the horse again.
“So how long have you been doing this?” I asked.
“Oh a year…” Patricia answered.
Later, I learned from Ben that Patricia was already an officer and was doing Nu Skin for more than a year. Maybe even a couple. It’s disappointing how an organization somehow makes their agents lie through their teeth. 🙁
To summarize, I have nothing against Nu Skin. I will not be like these bloggers who have written blog posts against Nu Skin distributors lambasting them. But personally, if there’s smoke, there’s fire… and the fact that Nu Skin tells their distributors not to mention that they’re from Nu Skin is smoke for me.
Now again, let me repeat. I have nothing against Nu Skin.
But I do have an issue with the way they recruit new distributors.
Or the way that they mislead people into thinking this is an easy get-rich scheme.
Or the fact that they misconstrue facts with bullshit. I still can’t get over the fact that they’ve linked the Discovery Channel clip with their product even though the clip didn’t even mention Nu Skin and their product!
Or that they try to blind people with greed. If your product is really good, you don’t have to give people a multi-level compensation scheme to market your products. Your products will sell themselves for you. So if this is the case, why emphasize money and greed instead of product knowledge in your training sessions?
In short, I don’t like that Nu Skin is a company with an ulterior motive. It gave me a bad taste in my mouth, and I felt bad hearing how experienced salespeople have to come up with misleading facts to sell their products. I think it is unethical AND wrong.
So the next time somebody invites you for coffee, be wary. Nothing is an innocent as it seems.
To Nu Skin leaders and distributors, please be more forthcoming with your customers. We are not idiots and we don’t like to be misled. Your products, if they are really good, should speak for themselves. Please don’t give me a get-rich scheme because you and I both know there is no easy way to get rich. You still have to work your ass off to get somewhere. And please stop with the ulterior motives. If we do discover you’re a Nu Skin distributor, then great! But please, please don’t ask us for coffee to catch up and then give us a pitch for Nu Skin.
You are better than that. Please do better than that.
For the rest of you readers, I think it’s better to watch this super short clip by billionaire John Paul Dejoria on what success is than to go to a Nu Skin pow-wow.
Happy weekend guys!
This article summarizes up my thoughts on MLM: http://www.timothytiah.com/2014/08/08/what-everyone-needs-to-know-about-mlm/
everyone doing business has an ulterior motive bonita nameless taipei – PROFIT. its no big secret. unless you are doing charity work? still people doing charity non profit deals still get salaries! nothings for free these days. but hey, everybody’s got to make money. would you work for free??? ill hire you. but i guess even You writing this blog has an ulterior motive – to make money selling negativity in disguise!
nothing free i guess hahaha. what a hypocrite.
all the mothers in earth works for FREE 24 hours a day 7 days a week…do i need to say more?
Hi Bonita! I’m also from the Ateneo, I also go to CCF, and I’m a networker as well. It makes me sad to read articles like this, but I must admit, you have a point.
First, Your friend should’ve mentioned that it’s a “business meeting” you’re going to, not a “catching up”. Some networkers call this “kidnapping”, where they deliberately invite friends/family for a party or a reunion and instead bring them to a seminar or a business presentation. Personally, I find this entire process weird. Being an entreprenuer (aside from this, I’m also managing my parents’ group of small pharmacies, while I’m also into designing), my day is filled with appointments and trying to insist the business upon people who are uninterested is a complete of waste of time. Aside from that, I value relationships very much, so sa invitation pa lang, I tell them na about the business. If they’re interested, good. If not, okay, at least no one got offended, no one felt cheated, and we can still meet up and really catch up.
Second, I’m not with NUSkin, so I’m not familiar with their marketing plan. The company that I am involved in does not sell tangible products, but a “system” – one that you can use to start your own business at home or wherever but it would be inapropriate for me to discuss the details, so let’s leave it at that. I guess what I’m trying to point out is, while you’re right that you’re friend is basically not an entreprenuer and that NUSkin may be misleading their “agents”, some MLM companies really lay all the cards on the table. The President of our company (who is my mentor, or in MLM terms, upline) always reminds me that we have to tell people everything — including the challenges, the rejections, and the discouragements. People should NEVER be coerced or simply hyped to sign up. That way, other than building a network, we are also able to build relationships. After nga I lay out the business, I give them a week to think about it, I don’t accept on the spot sign ins. For me, similar to a Dgroup Leader, I am accountable to them, I have to make sure they do the business right, I have to make sure they succeed.
I read the Timothy Kiah article, and all I can say is:
1. Yes, my company has a revolutionary product. It’s not soap, it’s not vitamins, it’s not gluta.
2. Yes, my company definitely gives ordinary people a chance to start their own business
3.Yes, my company’s marketing plan allows you to retire early (versus what other bogus companies say that you don’t have to work, money automatically comes in)
So, I guess a it’s matter of choosing the right company, and putting values and principle to your business. Similar to every endeavor, you have to set certain moral standards, so that you won’t get lost in the grey area on your way to your goal.
It’s sad that a lot of network marketers resort to disgusting levels of scheming and bamboozling just to introduce their business. It ruins the reputation of the industry.
My take is this: If the business is really amazing, you wouldn’t have to con people into checking it out. diba?
Thanks Mackie. For sharing with us that not all MLM companies have a script. For telling us your strategy is to lay it out to potential clients what your intention is, laying all cards out on the table and giving them enough time to think before “investing.”
So I don’t care if what you’re selling is soap, anti-aging products or an idea. What’s most important is how you do it. And it seems from what you’ve laid out in your comment, you’re doing it right.
More power to you!
>
It’s honesty, transparency and integrity folks!
At last! Someone with a logical mind, the ability to write well, and the patience to tell the entire story! 🙂
This is an excellent blow-by-blow account of what goes on before, during, and after a B.O.M. (Business Opportunity Meeting)
I was a Nuskin distributor long ago, built a group of downlines, and made a bit of money (emphasis on “a bit”).
The company is rock-solid. Some of the products are indeed fantastic and worth the premium price.
It’s the lousy distributors that mess up the company’s reputation.
And it seems that the group called Synergy (the group Dennis Ong is a part of) hasn’t changed their recruitment style. The scripts and strategies remain the same even after over a decade.
I met some good friends in that “group”. But I also met a whole bunch of fake friends. Ugh! Those were the disgusting ones.
Some facts:
– Dennis is truly a brilliant entrepreneur. I estimate that he’s making over 1.2M pesos per month.
– He and his wife are excellent salespeople, they could sell ice to eskimos, as the cliche goes.
– Sandy, the person who recruited Dennis, is exceptionally shrewd. He has made well over $2M (dollars!) from Nuskin alone, but he is also a smart investor in real estate, stocks, and others, so he has probably multiplied that million dollars a few times over.
– The Nuskin MLM structure can truly be considered a source of passive income. I’m not kidding!
– It can be a source of passive income because…
_ the upline Executive (that’s what they call distributors who consistently hit the sales quota) gets at least 5% commission from their downlines’ product sales.
_ Sandy has (in my estimate) over 30,000 distributors under him worldwide.
_ 30,000 multiplied by a small amount, say $20, per month is an enormous sales volume.
_ Multiply the sales volume by 5%, and you get his monthly income.
_ That doesn’t include all the other cash bonuses and extra perks (which include all-expense paid trips to exotic destinations).
_ To make it totally passive, Sandy can set up an automatic ordering system to purchase products to hit his monthly quota of $3000 (only 10% of his income).
_ At a specified day of the month, commissions are deposited directly to his bank account.
_ Zero effort
– But! A big BUT! One has to work as hard as Sandy (or Dennis) did, and be as dedicated as he is. I saw how they built his team of distributors. It did not come easy at all! He’s just harvesting the fruits of his labor.
I did not make it because I was not as dedicated as they were. Not even 10% of their level of dedication.
Those dudes who made were willing to personally apply make-up, facial masks, and other creams on senior citizens just to demo their products and sell a whole bunch of them afterwards.
I quit because I did not like the person I was becoming. I became money-centered. Every time I see a human being, I mentally calculate how much I can earn from him/her before approching.
I did not care if the sneaky tactics cause them to avoid me in social gatherings.
Friends, relatives, strangers, former enemies, it didn’t matter. I would approach them all and ignore the fact that I could piss them off.
That was not the person I want to be. So I gave it all up.
And looking back, it was one of the best decisions of my life.
If you want to know some specific insider details, ask away and I shall respond with what I remember.
It’s about time these shameful creatures get exposed.
Warning! Despite saying “no” to your friend, if you can still consider her one, expect a follow-up call sometime soon.
Thank you Oldskin for this insightful comment. Honestly, I didn’t know it was called a Business Opportunity meeting. All I thought I was attending a simple presentation.
Anyway, thank you for giving us clear, honest color on what goes on behind the scenes. It’s great to have a distributor’s point of view… and a former distributor at that! 🙂
At least you got my point: No, I don’t discount the company or its overpriced products. No, I don’t dislike the people. Patricia for example is still a friend. I do not ignore her just because she invited me to Nu Skin. It’s not a crime to be invited to a meeting and nobody pointed a gun to my head.
But you’re right, “It’s the lousy distributors that mess up the company’s reputation.” Again, I have nothing about the company. What I didn’t like was that the distributors pre-planned everything with the motive of getting me to attend the BOM. There was a script and it was religiously followed by the two distributors (Patricia and my husband’s cousin) I talked to. I felt fooled. I thought I was catching up with a long-lost friend. Instead, the real motive for the coffee date was to invite me to the BOM.
What’s worse, when I got to the BOM, the whole session was organized in such a way to join the Nu Skin rank, down to how everyone was seated, or how the questions were phrased. The messages were confusing too. Dennis talked about anti-aging being an important trend, but didn’t spend a lot of time talking about the actual product he was trying to sell. He downplayed greed but encouraged financial freedom. Impressive concepts like passive income was thrown around, but what people forgot to mention was that passive income in MLM was not truly passive!
Like you said, it takes a LOT of effort to get enough passive income at Nu Skin! If you want to get rich like Dennis or Sandy, you would have to set up thousands of coffee dates to hawk your product and recruit more downlines. It involves people trying to avoid you, knowing fully well that you’ll be selling them another get-thin/get-pretty/get-younger products at expensive prices. It entails planning, time, effort, blood, sweat and tears. This was intentionally downplayed at the meeting. People came out from it thinking this is a get-rich-quick scheme. Newsflash: There is no easy way to get rich.
So thank you OldSkin for your balanced comments. I am glad you found happiness and satisfaction away from NuSkin. Do you have a blog? I would love to read your stories and opinions if you have it. 🙂
Oh, no, no, no. I cannot reveal my identity because some friends are still in that industry and I don’t want anyone to know that it’s me revealing their secrets 😀
I feel like the “masked magician” of the tv show “Breaking the Magician’s Code: Magic’s Biggest Secrets Finally Revealed”. Many of the other magicians wanted to silence him, hahaha!
And yeah, I felt so free and so “clean” after I quit Nuskin. No more bait-and-switch, half-truths, and trickery! 😀
Reblogged this on Drei alquiros and commented:
Clap clap on this blog. I totally agree with this!
For this, your friend wanted to catch up. In my girl friend’s experience her friend wanted to offer her a contractual job in their company. She even said that she got her resume somewhere and heard that she was open to employment opportunities. AGK!
To know now that they actually have a f*cking script is just CRAZY!!!
Thanks for the reblogging, Drei. Yes, I was surprised too. Actually, I was kind of impressed. They really have selling down to a science! 🙂
Bonita bonita… be true to yourself…everybody want money… in my own opinion? We cannot call fruits of labor “greediness” i don’t agree with your use b of this wording. “Greediness” of good example are those from the goverment who grab our taxes without sweating.
It sounds simple to me… it was not your piece of cake :~)
The same marketing strategh with USANA and ROYALE. Your experience, from a college friend who wants to catch up until the marketing invite or talk from their upline, I also experienced that. It is just that I was not interested so they did not get me as their new recruit. :p
So, it’s the same formula everywhere. I am not alone. Sigh, why can’t they be more forthcoming…?
naku jasmine… ROYALE is a scam.flp,amway, nuskin happens to be legit. big difference. but i guess bonita would not really know the difference. just like she thinks all diamonds are fake since she never knows how to distinguish them. so she thinks all people who sell diamonds at a high price is tricking everybody. so she would rather stick to negative blogging.. that way nobody knows she’s making money from your comments shhhh! i wonder who shes working for 🙂 like most bloggers – gun for hire.
Nuskin is definitely legit. No question about it. Condescending distributors like you are what we should be wary of.
I encountered the same experience with my bestfriend when I was in grade school. She was all nice and all yet she lured me into catching up turned marketing blah blah of the long gone GFI and other networking that I forgot who apparently sells fertilizers! Why on earth would I even buy fertilizers for plants.. Tsk!
Most MLM are like this. They would spill out on you all the greediness and sometimes its so frustrating to see that ordinary people are attracted into this kind of business. I am a user of MLM products (supplements to be specific) but I can attest that the products are really effective and good. What I don’t agree about is the culture they are creating inside the company and the kind of people who have become millionaires who don’t have the ethics of how to do a Real Sales and Marketing strategy. They will lure you into believing that it is easy work and easy money when it doesn’t really work that way. Hope a lot more people will come into their senses that if u want to be rich, as you do not want to be taken advantage then do not take advantage of others.
Is it USANA?
You’re right OpenMindedMon, there is no easy way to make money unless it’s illegal. 🙂
and how do you define illegal bonita? what does meriam webster say about the definition? baka mali na naman gamit mo sa terminology.
just because you find it hard to make money, it doesn’t mean people who are smarter and earns more money is illegal. perhaps they are just … more financially educated?? iba lang specialization niyo. sa yo is writing.. sa kanila is business- making money.
sam lee, do you and your downlines issue official receipts at full retail price (not the distributor’s) when non-distributors/customers buy from you?
You brought me back to 2006-ish… “Pharmanex” was how they brand it last time around. The building was in Ortigas, Ericson tower/building to be exact.
I had a great time reading your blog!
This is true! I also have a friend from Ateneo who invited me to join the Nu Skin! She also did the same thing to me and my boyfriend.
She first talked to me on facebook. She asked me to meet her up somewhere in katipunan. It started from there. She and her partner discussed about Nu Skin. It sounded like a good source of income.
She scheduled me again for another meeting to give her the membership fee (13,500). I received the products and some forms. After a week, my boyfriend and I decided to quit because we felt something wasn’t right. So, i called her up that we had to quit. We talked for like 2 hours, she was trying to convince me not to leave the group. But, i still insisted that we had to. My friend told me to meet her in Octagon Ortigas so she can give me back the money. When we went there, i was surprised. It is indeed the building of Nu Skin. She was really up to something. Before she gave the money, she asked me to go to the seminar or talk about the Nu skin. I said no. I’ve made up my mind.
We were really pissed off because they were like forcing us to stay.
And now, i’ve read your blog. I am now so thankful that we left that Nu Skin thing.
Yeap. My experiences were with NuSkin & Usana. Having studied business and sales, I already had an inkling of their strategies for selling, at the same time became a keen target for them since I have the “skills”.
One thing that I didn’t like in particular with Usana, for instance, is the constant display of “wealth” or materialism esp in social media. I told my friend I am never the one to boast nor be active on social media just for that purpose. I was told it doesn’t matter bec there are part-timers who don’t even post any products on their fb’s or their “rewards” are “partners”, but of course compared to those who do, they don’t earn as much, which wasn’t told to me but based on my observation. I didn’t buy it.
Also, in Usana, one of their top earners who started the group Xtreme advised on what to do about skeptic friends / connections, her answer was in the lines of, “if they don’t believe in you, why waste time on them, move on to the next one”. That left a bad taste, thinking that that was exactly what my high school friend did. After having pitched to me and me declining politely, she just disappeared, bec I am no use for her profitability. I don’t really know where they get the gall to risk goodwill of relationships. I’m also not too keen with their hand sign, it’s like an upper westside hood/gang sign, that you have to do in every picture and also the need to always post flashy cars that are not really theirs but their ‘coaches’ or uplines just to have this facade of wealth.
My girlfriend in particular got a bit pissed off bec one of the dudes she met at Usana used her bikini pic (she was invited to a pool party by her Usana friends, afterwards she realized it was a ploy for her to join) in his profile without her permission. The pic collage was supposed to show what a ‘good life’ said Usana dude has. He had his picture in the center in a race car that isn’t his and other pics that included basically, girls, cars, vacation, family. She even barely knew the guy! He’s lucky my girlfriend told me to ignore him.
70+% of it is smoke and mirrors I tell you.
Interesting read. I’ve also received calls from my friends before, never reached the part where they introduce me to Nu Skin, but it’s most probably the same company since they asked me to go to Octagon but I declined. There’s also a part in their script where they flatter their potential recruits. They told me they remembered me because I was funny and they thought it would be fun to work with me. Pretty persuasive!
Well, my entrepreneurial competence and spirit were mentioned at the coffee meeting. I guess that’s the flattery part!
Hi.
I feel for you on sharing your experience on being invited to join your friend’s business the wrong way. This is the reason mlm should be professionalized.
First of, I’ve been distributing Nuskin & Pharmanex products since 2003. Though i do not belong on the high earning distributors/executives of the company, I have earned substantially on retail profits (buying & selling) and commissionable bonuses from the company as i continue to do business with them.
After reading your entry I can see that your friend could have qualified you better to see if the Nuskin opportunity was for you. This is the qualification process
1. Set up an appointment with the candidate and make it clear that the meeting is to talk about business.
This part is mostly mixed with catching up. I personally dont like to mix business and pleasure. If the meeting was about catchup, there should be no business talk. Business transactions should be done in the office.
2. Present the business and show facts only, no hype.
Sit the candidate down on the Opportunity Meeting and let the candidate decide based on what he/she understands of it. If she gets it, she gets it. Smart people dont need to be convinced.
The discovery episode on epigenetics highlighted that companies are now capitalizing on gene science to make better products. Though Discovery Channel Asia is not allowed to endorse any brand or company, it is clear that Nuskin’s scientists, Dr Joe Chang and the Scientists in LifegenTech were among the people that were interviewed. This is no surprise because the business of capitalizing epigenetics has been pioneered by Nuskin. Other companies are also starting to venture on this platform
3. After the presentation, kindly ask if the candidate wants to proceed.
If not interested, say your goodbyes.
If not interested but willing to refer, get recommendations.
If interested but need to think about it, set another meeting to discuss.
If interested and can start immediately, have them purchase a startup package and schedule for training.
Like all opportunities, you can decline or accept.
Just a clarification on the GREED issue. There is nothing wrong wiith having money. The more money you have, the more options you can do with it.
Options such as give more provision to your family, send your kids to a better school, give more to the church, live life with less hassle, travel the world and see the world. The decision to do good with more money solely lies on the person receiving the money. It is of the person and not of the business that puts it to action. I have known people that became bad, arrogant and self centered having more money. I also know a lot more people that are humble, more patient and live purposeful lives having more money.
In my opinion, any entrepreneur who claims he is not desiring more money leading him to be starting a business is a hypocrite. It goes back to the core idea that having money is not wrong but loving it/ desiring more of it is.
I have been working with Mr Ong for the longest time and I could say he is but full of timely wisdom in business. He and his wife are very private and humble people and based on what you have said on this post, they communicate a CLEAR message that when you stop thinking about money, you start to focus on things that are more important in life (whether it be spiritual, family, etc)
Also on the 30M bank fixed deposit to earn 50-100k? If you took it literally, then you have missed a very important message he was sharing. He highlighted this to say that it is more difficult to SAVE 30M vs finding executives to build for a passive income stream. 30M might be during his younger years bec he is now turning 40’s.
The MLM business model is indeed an asset that which you build actively for the 3-5 years, it will provide you with a passive, permanent source of income. This is not coming from me, but from Robert Kiyosaki and Donald Trump. So its your words against theirs.
Lastly, I’d like to point out that Entrepreneurs are not limited to START-UPS.
If you run a water purifying shop, who supplies you the water? the equipment? Given your definition above, you are an AGENT of NAWASA.
If you run a mini grocery store, what products are you selling? Given your definition, you are an AGENT of P&G, UNILIEVER, URC and JACK&JILL.
If you have a restaurant and sell chicken from Magnolia serve it and named your restaurant Maxxs, arent you also an AGENT of Magnolia??
My point is this, There is no difference if your an agent, self-manufacturing or referring individual. To be an entrepreneur is to be able to SPOT opportunities and create business in a form of partnership, proprietory or corporation.
Business is a matter of understanding how everything is put together as 1 entity. Nuskin is a SUPPLIER, I use their products to cater to customers on whatever means possible on a professional level (that means, no back-biting, no underplay, no exaggerations, no false claims), I earn profit from every sale. Nuskin gives me a commissionable bonus for ordering by volumes.
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Network Marketing (MLM) is here to stay so rather than fighting it, seek to understand it better. Because like it or not, marketing thru networks is and become the game changer of ANY business.
Tom, on the subject of professionalizing Direct Selling, and Multi-Level/Network Marketing, check out this site if you haven’t already. http://www.idsei.com. It’s here. Now. (just sharing).
I just want to comment on the part where you gave examples to justify that those who work for networking are entrepenuers. 1st of all if you run a grocery store that sells different products. yes by all means thats an entrepenuer. the difference is a grocery owner wont recruit someone to also venture, and they dont belong into 1 company entity. how about those who do franchises by defenition they are entrepeneurs for the have created market in place where it doesnt exist yet example mcdo. the only way they will allow you to have a franchise is if they approved the location on where you will put it. and so the franchisees did create a market or a need in a place where it doesnt exist yet. and again no they dont recruit under one company structure. if they do tell their friends, their goal is to help not profit from them. they wont have any incenstives. hence its not recruitment for profit. now Multilevel marketing. The one that created the entity that is registered in the SEC. the company. that guy is the entrepenuer now the others that are tasks with the main goal to recruit and profit from those recruit those are AGENTS. now whats the difference? the entrepenuer is the one that is registered to do bussiness his name is on it. paying taxes. now lets says one is just there to get products and sell it without the intention of recruiting and profiting from that recuitment he is indeed an entrepenuer.but i think that guy should register 1st and have a business permit to be legal. there are agents and entrepenuers. one has to be proud of their work. they dont have to fake thier titles and pretend something they are not for the purpose of “Marketing” the bussiness.
I just want to comment on the part where you gave examples to justify that those who work for networking are entrepenuers. 1st of all if you run a grocery store that sells different products. yes by all means thats an entrepenuer. the difference is a grocery owner wont recruit someone to also venture, and they dont belong into 1 company entity. how about those who do franchises by defenition they are entrepeneurs for the have created market in place where it doesnt exist yet example mcdo. the only way they will allow you to have a franchise is if they approved the location on where you will put it. and so the franchisees did create a market or a need in a place where it doesnt exist yet. and again no they dont recruit under one company structure. if they do tell their friends, their goal is to help not profit from them. they wont have any incenstives. hence its not recruitment for profit. now Multilevel marketing. The one that created the entity that is registered in the SEC. the company. that guy is the entrepenuer now the others that are tasks with the main goal to recruit and profit from those recruit those are AGENTS. now whats the difference? the entrepenuer is the one that is registered to do bussiness his name is on it. paying taxes. now lets says one is just there to get products and sell it without the intention of recruiting and profiting from that recuitment he is indeed an entrepenuer.but i think that guy should register 1st and have a business permit to be legal. there are agents and entrepenuers. one has to be proud of their work. they dont have to fake thier titles and pretend something they are not for the purpose of “Marketing” the bussiness.
I second Beejay’s comments. Risk is the operative word. An entrepreneur is “a person who organizes and operates a business or businesses, taking on greater than normal financial risks in order to do so.” We don’t make commissions from sales. But if our company don’t sell, we go out of business. That’s what being an entrepreneur means.
Meanwhile, if you fall off the grind, does Nu Skin go bankrupt? What if Dennis or Sandy retires? Will Nu Skin stop operating? Absolutely not. Why? Because you are their distributor. A glorified sales agent so to speak. According to the Merriam Webster dictionary, a sales agent is someone who is authorized or appointed by the manufacturer to sell or distribute his products within a given territory and is given a commission for every sale he makes. You said, “Nuskin gives me a commissionable bonus for ordering by volumes.” That’s what a sales agent get when they sell. And you know what? THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT.
So Tom, enough with the judgement please. There is nothing wrong in being a sales agent. In fact, my company uses agents as well to distribute our products. They go out on field, hawk our products and after a successful sale, get commission. It’s hard work. It’s decent work. It’s noble work. Imagine, rain or shine, they need to talk to clients, get them to order our products, and followup. I need them to operate my business, and without them, I have to close shop.
But I would never delude them into thinking they’re entrepreneurs. And honestly, after seeing how hard it is to manage a business, they would not want to be an entrepreneur either. 🙂
Thank you Tom for your comment. Like you said, the coffee date DID mix business with pleasure. For one, I was lured to the coffee date to catch up. I came out of the date with a pressing invitation (complete with text followup) to go to a BOM. That’s not a catch-up session, Tom. That’s a sales pitch.
And to add salt to the wound, I did ask her when she invited me how she is doing, and where she is working now. Instead of telling me that she’s now part of Nu Skin, Patricia told me she would just tell me the name of the group she’s with when we meet. I would’ve appreciated it more if she said it earlier. Because honestly, I would’ve been happy to meet her at my office to talk about Nu Skin. As you mentioned, it’s the best venue for doing business.
So why can’t more Nu Skin distributors follow this rule?
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I like your comment, “Smart people don’t need to be convinced.” Tom, you don’t know me or how smart my other readers are. But I do know it’s not very smart to imply that only smart people get the presentation. Please Tom, you are old enough not to name call. 🙂
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Oh and I never said greed or money is bad. Actually, being a businessperson, the potential to make more money than going corporate is one of the biggest factors on why I chose this path. What I didn’t like from the presentation was that Dennis made making money look so easy. And that easy money/financial freedom/early retirement comes from joining Nu Skin. For example, he said:
— “I am at Nu Skin because I can spend more time with my family. After I got married, my priorities changed.” —> This implied that with Nu Skin, you can spend more time with family vs. working corporate. He didn’t mention all the time you have to devote to Nu Skin to get enough commissions selling and recruiting to spend more time with your family. That’s a LOT of coffee dates, Tom.
— “How would you like to retire? Would you like to retire when you’re 60? What if you’re 45?” –> Implying you can retire whenever you want. Well, retirements depends on how many people on your downline. Sandy has 30,000 recruits wordwide according to an ex-distributors. Do you know how long and how much effort it took him to recruit 30,000 people?!
— “The reason why I chose to work for Nu Skin is so I can live on passive income. You know what passive income means? It means making money work for you even if you don’t know anything.” —> Yes, but with Nu Skin, you still have a monthly quota (hence, some effort), and you have to ensure you recruit enough people on your downline to make you a lot more money (hence, even more effort! Heck, MLM is not a walk in the park).
Look, I don’t dislike Dennis. I don’t even know him from Adam. If I met him again, I would even say hi to him. But I know was what I heard — There was a lot of truth telling, but not the whole truth!
In summary, money is never easy. To make money requires time, effort, blood, sweat, tears and all. It’s not impossible, and kudos to all MLM distributors who make it, but it’s not a walk in the park either. I just hoped the talk would’ve been more about the products and the efforts entailed to make it at Nu Skin than selling us a dream that we can make tons of money/retire early if we joined Nu Skin.
P.S. And yes, I took what I heard LITERALLY. That’s what happens when you give out presentations. Even if you don’t really mean it. So if you don’t want people to believe you literally, please be more clear and responsible with what you say.
Hi Bonita, thanks for reading my feedback. I apologize for any name calling i may havn towards you. You clearly have gud understanding on how a business operates, being in one yourself. However i’d like to encourage you to know more about Network Marketing and why Kiyosaki calls it “the business of the 21st Century”. MLM is an EVOLUTION and not many people are ready to accept that.
Yes, it takes a lot of coffee sessions to screen candidates. Like i said i for one wouldnt attempt inviting someone for business after 1 catchup session unless he/she expresses interest in pursuing such.
Id like to clarify that the flaw here is the PROCESS, not the industry, nor the company. In my opinion, the presenter gave just enough info so that the candidate does the ff:
1. Get interested and move to action
2. Get interested and ask more questions
3. Does not get interested and decline the opportunity
I believe all of the above options are given at the end of the presentation.
To explain everything (how specifically you earn the millions) would require another seating/session. Yes, another coffee.hehe
I would suggest that the title be updated to “My personal experience with a nuskin invitation -a not so unpleasant one”
Cheers, Bonita
Finally, a more balanced comment!
Hahaha, after seeing how badly the haters are commenting, I kinda shudder at joining any MLM organization. Sorry but Tom, can you blame me? These guys can be vicious (e.g., Paola)!
That said, I do have to admire the industry. Again don’t think I am lambasting the industry. I am not. It gives people livelihood. It works. Some people get rich with it. It’s a legal, noble job with hardworking people. You have to in order to get enough down lines. The only thing I said is it’s not as easy as it may seem. And most people find this fact out only after their first purchase.
I get your point about Dennis as well. I think the intention is good, but with 70 people listening, he just has to be more careful with what he says. If the message is intended for what you say, just rephrase the message so it’ll look more logical.
So like any businesses, MLM is flawed. But it doesn’t mean it cannot correct. Just a few tweaks will do — Remove the script. Tell us proudly you’re from Nu Skin. Set up meetings in the office. Stick to clear logic and facts at the presentation. Don’t just spew financial concepts left and right. Share the dream but also the hard road that comes with it. Nothing hard really.
Only when you are open to changes can you truly improve. And us non-MLM people will stop shying away whenever Nu Skin people call. 🙂
>
Now you’re calling me vicious! Oh my gosh hahaha how was I vicious? Really, this is ridiculous! Sobrang OA a hahaha
But on another and more serious note, I wish you could write this comment of yours on your main blog post. And revise the title so as not to mislead people, as well. Because the tone of your blog really comes across as super negative. Wish it were as balanced as your comments 🙂
P.S. Also about the Discovery Channel, hope you could edit your post and admit your lapse there. 😉
after reading how bonita stabs her friend at the back. i shudder at how these types of backdoor bullying can be used by just any tom dick and harry to voice their negative opinion at the hope of making money selling negativity. this industry of blogging should really be regulated by law so that these anonymous wannabe’s are compelled to be transparent with their identities so they can be sued for libel if they wronged someone. not hide behind anonymity because they are not really confident about their viewpoints to be right or wrong. after all, we are only reading her version of this. for all you know. the friend who invited her maybe an honorable smart person who did everything right, and bonita just colored it negatively. for instance, she was invited to see a presentation. she was not “tricked” into going, and she went voluntarily, and left voluntarily. wheres the wrong here? nobody pressured her. but of course saying this is not bad news enough so she has to exaggerate to make it a better read for people looking at the bad side of anything.
tom i don’t think bonita is really interested in your proper way of doing things, because it doesn’t sell, she is biased , using negativity to make money. can’t you see it? she is like the bloodsucking journalists and paparazzi that sells bad news and bad pictures. so even when everything is done properly and she actually had the choice, she still complains . read her blog again and you would see that she event went for the second time when nobody forced her to, and nobody chased after her diba? do nobody was really desperate to get her. she probably was not that good of a catch? or maybe its just not the seller’s style to pester useless people who are not interested? so bonita here has to dramatize, sensationalize, romanticize and make her friend look evil to sell her blog.. and pretend she doesn’t like profit. but wants a kick back from behind 🙂 typical hypocrite. i feel sorry for her friend actually.
I on the other hand, don’t feel sorry for you, sam lee, because you are utterly pathetic. Are you under Pax’s group?
Exactly same points I have on Nu Skin. And I think they usually stay and get their prospect recruits in Starbucks. I was “almost” invited by someone too and good thing I learned right away that he’s from Nu Skin. I declined in every attempt he made to invite me. Haha
I like how you backed up your article with very sound arguments. good use of logic! Perfect way on how to mix both your opinion and fact. Keep it up!
All i can say is that this original piece written by this “nameless in taipei” is a very well written piece of a very subjective and personalized opinion of what is and what isn’t right. but all in all, she says nothing valid except objects to the ” way” things are done.. just as i do not like the way ” call center” agents call me to sell bank loans, credit cards, etc etc.. it doesn’t mean the call center business, or citibank or credit cards are not good businesses.
The fact that she calls mr ong a liar for saying you need 30m to get 100k passive , shows alot of ignorance. it’s rather very poor business sense on her part. so funny. coming from someone who claims to know business, kulang daw ang 30,000,000. referring ONLY to bank rates which is of course a stupid and lousy way to invest 30,000,000.
if you cannot make even 100,000 in passive income with 30,000,000 you have got to be terrible in business.
simply buying a property at greenbelt residences and renting it out would already yield 100,000/month and that wouldn’t cost you 30m.. seems that our shameless from taiwan is not even in complete understanding of the term called ” passive income” as she has a very myopic view of how it is derived , not knowing that while you quote robert kiyosaki,whos material you claim to know, you at the same time disagree with the very author you claim to have understood. Robert Kiyosaki does in fact endorse network marketing.
a good way to earn passive income , it’s strange you do not know.
all i’m saying is, it seems your obvious inexperience as an entrepreneur does not qualify you to be a judge of what is good or bad business, even when you write well.. you should consider a career in writing more than becoming a business owner. the way you write this seems to say that your friend patricia did not give you an option to say no. all your friend did was tell you about a business, you can say no, and she did not chase after you, you willingly went and saw and left. you even came a second time out of your own volition.thats that. whats wrong with that?
its just a small person over reacting to a small thing showing forth your obvious ignorance and lack of experience 🙂 this is really a shallow piece of nothing that is written well by smart but not to smart people.
what i dislike more is that you act so confident yet conceal yourself to be nameless. sounds like you have more confidence talking bad about your friends than you have confidence with your brain. seems you are not a very good friend.
ako simple lang, pag ayaw ko, i say no. thats it. no need to backbite and badmouth others especially your friend this way. but those of us who are smarter can see how shallow your viewpoint is. live and let live.
Sam, when call center agents call me up (and they can be pesky creatures at times), they always tell me:
– Who they are calling for (e.g., Hi, I’m calling from Citibank…)
– Why they are calling (e.g., We’re wondering if you’re interested in applying for our new Citibank credit card that offers you 5% rebate for every Shell purchase)
– And Whether I would be free to talk about this further (e.g., Would you have some time to talk more about this wonderful promo?)
Different from my experience with Nu Skin distributors.
– They are not straightforward with which company they’re working for (e.g., Uhhh… I’ll tell you the group I’m working with when I see you.”)
– They invite you for coffee, but the ulterior motive is to invite you to their presentation (e.g., After listening to me yack about my personal life, finally Patricia mentions the BOM meeting)
– The distributor sits behind you at the BOM. So they get one-on-one time with you after the presentation. Talk about pressure!!! If they didn’t want to pressure you, why not let us go home first and think about the presentation instead of forcing us to go one-on-one time with the recruiter.
Now that’s the BIG GAPING DIFFERENCE.
i too have been invited several times by friends selling me insurance, mlm ,real estate, investment propositions etc etc.. but as long as my friend does not “pester me” or pressures me into buying. i’m cool with that. were still friends even after i say no. It’s as if you are saying that everyone who “sells” something to a friend is bad. and it’s wrong to sell to your friend.i’d say it’s more wrong to backbite your friend.
hey everyone needs to make money. and every business owner who does not want to sell his stuff is not a real businessman. any business owner who is not ” greedy” for profit should become a priest instead. its so hypocrite.
Sam, I will not claim to know what passive income without having experienced it firsthand, be it your definition or mine. But for your benefit, I will try to be patient and explain the holes in your comment:
1) The true meaning of passive income is your money works for you at MINIMAL or NO EFFORT AT ALL. That means, your money begets you money rain or shine, weekday or holidays, while you sleep, while you shop abroad or stay at home. It works for you, even if you’re NOT working. Putting in the bank is passive income. Once you leave it, after a specific point in time, you come back with the principal + interest. Making money via bonds, stocks, real estate, or in your online/brick-and-mortar business is not really passive, as actual work still needs to be done to make money.
2) So let’s talk about real estate then. If you own real estate, you would understand that making money via buying condo units is not a walk in the park. There’s still a lot of effort that needs to be done to enjoy the monthly rent. So this is why your reasoning that real estate is guaranteed passive income don’t hold water. Why? Here are 4 good reasons:
i) RENTING OUT PROPERTIES IS NOT AS EASY AS YOU THINK — Take for example The Residences at Greenbelt (TRAG), your favorite example. Currently, Olx.ph displays 41 (!) active for sale or for rent advertisements for TRAG. Forty-one freaking ads! With supply overwhelming demand, you can imagine just how hard it is to rent a property out. Even then, after lowering your price and offering better payment schemes, there is no guarantee you’ll get the right tenant! One Makati unit for example has been unrented out for 2 years, and we’re paying Php 20,000 association dues per month for it!
ii) THERE ARE A LOT OF HIDDEN RECURRING COSTS TO OWNING A CONDO — My friend living in Ayala got slapped with a Php 175,000 fee for re-structuring their wall, as per new Makati city rules and regulations. Our Makati condo association overcharged us for the new elevators and CCTV cameras. We also have to pay additional for Christmas gifts for the condo staff. This excludes interest costs if you took out a loan to buy your condo, all fees of which you still have to pay whether or not you rent out your unit.
iii) REMODELING IS A PRICEY B*TCH — If you got a bad tenant, you have to remodel your unit. If your unit remains unused, you have to spice it up to successfully rent it out. Our bathroom cost us Php 400,000 to redo. That’s one freaking bathroom. For the walls, it’s Php 50,000 to repaint. For the floor, Php 60,000 for polyurethane shine. The fees goes on and on…
iv) CONDO PRICES ARE TRICKY. THEY GO UP, BUT THEY ALSO GO DOWN — And lastly, condo is not land. Land is in short supply, but condos for sale are a dime a dozen. Wanna buy in QC, BGC, Ortigas, Greenhills, Makati, Alabang or Nuvali? I have access to all of these properties, and I get offered this or that property every other day. Again, condos is NOT land. Whereas land values appreciate over time, condo values remain stagnant if not decrease especially as they age. Nobody wants to live in an old building. They want new developments. What does this mean? A unit in Makati cost Php 20M over the last 5 years because it’s a 17 year old building. This despite being in a very good location in Ayala (in front of Greenbelt, 2 minutes walking distance from Rustan’s).
So are you thinking of real estate as again passive income?
Think again!
Real estate — to buy, own, lease out, and manage, is a LOT OF HARD WORK. It’s hard work to maintain a unit and find a good tenant who will not destroy it. And to think it’s as easy as buying, and renting it out the same week is the same as thinking joining Nu Skin will make you a multi-millionaire without any effort.
3) Wah, I’m surprised that you insult and name call me without really understanding who I am, what I do, or what my background is. The post is not personal. I am not backbiting my friend or Dennis. In fact, if you re-read my posts, you’ll notice that I only criticized the way that the distributors try to recruit people. I don’t like the way they tell the truth but not the whole truth. But never did I say that Dennis is a bad businessman. That would be a profoundly ignorant thing to say. Like you, I don’t know him. But I heard him speak, and I felt that his talk had a lot of holes as well, all of which I’ve communicated in my blog.
I am also not hiding behind my blog. Perceptive people can easily find out who I am just by reading my posts. It’s not a big secret. Unlike other people though, I do not leave comments and hide behind a name nobody can click on. And talking about my experience with Nu Skin is not backbiting my friend. It’s telling MY truth in MY blog. Which is my right. 🙂
Soundbox over.
@sam lee: so are you ranting about what the blogger wrote and reacted about nu skin? Or is your comment a rant against back biting and hypocrisy? The blogger had a point and so as the other dude retaliating on the blog’s statement that to be an entrep, you need not sell your own self made product–for it would be, most definitely, a rare occassion to produce product that you (from scratch–base materials and all) created and sold to a certain and constant consumers. I understand you though. But the one who wrote this blog just wants nu skin to change their approach to new distributors and consumers. Maybe sell the product and not THAT SLICE of passive income which seems unachievable if not worked for. Chill bro. No need to go b*tching. Peace
Similar story happened to me a few years ago while I was still in college. All I gotta say is that if you are a student at UA&P, which is a hop, skip, and a jump away from the Octagon Building, please be wary of these individuals. A classmate of mine was telling me about a “business meeting” that i should attend with him. Lo and behold it was nu skin! My course was in management, so granted, I was a little curious to see what “business” he was really excited about, i attended.
He definitely didn’t tell me about the company beforehand and perhaps it was my fault a bit for not asking. I went through a very similar process ending the night with a sales pitch of what products i should buy for myself. At the time to join the recruitment there was a 9k buy-in. They even offered to pay for my buy in first until i can pay them back on a monthly basis.
My takeaway from this is that Its just sad that they have started recruiting students, many of my classmates at the time, including myself were on allowance from our parents. And I was not about to ask my parents for 9k for a business to recruit people.
Honestly i felt taken advantage of.
I discussed what had happened that day with my parents, for curious insight.
They brought up a few good points.
1. People with lucrative businesses aren’t as sharing with their business ideas (honestly speaking) for fear of competitors.
2. If their approach comes off too strong, ask yourself why.
3. If a business wanted you, you shouldn’t have to pay for a buy-in.
Thanks mom and dad!
I disagree with points 1 and 3…
1) People with lucrative businesses aren’t as sharing with their business ideas (honestly speaking) for fear of competitors.
3) If a business wanted you, you shouldn’t have to pay for a buy-in.
Try to attend at least one start-up pitching event, which has become common these days. The founders openly tell you (almost) everything you need to know to compete directly against them!
These founders are constantly looking for investors and partners to help them expand.
The main difference between network marketers and start-up founders is: Most MLMers rely on sneakiness, while start-up founders seeking funding are practically required to be transparent.
I’d have to agree with Oldskin on this. Honestly, business is not only about the idea but rather the execution. We’re not afraid people can copy us. Let them try…
You see, people can easily copy my business, but would they go through the trouble if they knew of the profit margins? Or the hard work that goes into it? Or the frustrating of dealing with the type of people I deal with every day? To start a business is easy. But to survive? Now, that’s another story! 🙂
Thank you so much for writing this. I thought my wife and I had a very unique experience. After coffee with a childhood friend, I decided to break the friendship because I saw how we were considered as mere recruits. It was quite heartbreaking. This is how networking destroys friendships…
I’ve had my own personal experiences with Nu Skin. A friend of mine from high school called me up not too long after I graduated from college asking me how I was, if I already found a job, etc. When I said no, she asked me if I was interested to join the company she was working for. When I asked her for the company’s name, she deliberately mentioned the company’s name fast so that I couldn’t tell whether what she said was “NSC Consumer Goods Corporation” or “NSE Consumer Goods Corporation”. She said she would like to discuss opportunities with me, so she asked me if I was free to meet up with her and a co-worker at a specific date and time. I told her I’ll have to think about it first. End of conversation.
After a few weeks, she called me up again. After the first phone call, I began doing research and became more familiar with this whole networking business, so I became more wary. This time, I said no. End of conversation.
Not too long after, another woman calls me up. Usual recruitment spiel. She said I was referred to her by . I declined. End of conversation.
After a few months (and I was still unemployed at the time), a random woman whose name I don’t recall called me up. She said she got my resume from and was willing to discuss opportunities with me. I asked for the company’s name, and she wouldn’t say it at first. She would redirect the conversation to something else. I asked again, and just like my high school friend, she mentioned the company’s name in such a way that I wouldn’t easily understand, but I did hear something like “NSC”. She told me that the company is based in the US and is listed in the New York Stock Exchange. She told me to go to this specific place, and to come in business attire. I declined. End of conversation.
Finally, I was employed full-time by a reputable company in Makati, but the NU Skin people just wouldn’t stop.
One time while I was at the office, I got a phone call from an unknown number. The woman on the other line introduced herself and used the same spiel as the others (i.e. opportunities to earn). I told her I was already employed so I had to decline. End of conversation.
Out of the blue, my high school friend started getting in touch with me again, after a few months since the last time she called me up. Some days, she would text me something like “Hey how are you?” I never replied. I knew what she was really after. Some days, she would call me up. I never picked up any of her calls. This happened several times until, I guess, she finally gave up on me. She hasn’t been in touch for a few months now.
The said high school friend was also quite persistent in asking me to join this youth activist group that she’s a part of.
These networking people will stop at nothing because of their greed. They don’t even care about the fact that what they’re doing is actually ruining their relationships with friends or even family.
This is one of the reasons why our country is a 3rd world nation, our people are too “employee mindset”, they do not see the potential in an opportunity.
It is clear that the writer of this article, a.k.a Bonita did not even understand a thing on the presentation that she attended, I think that she just went there to negate each and every information that the speaker would tell, i don’t know why, maybe to feed her own ego, and it is very funny that she has the confidence on writing an article on something that she didn’t clearly understood. But the most interesting part is most of the people who commented agreed on her statement even if they too did not fully understand it. Well same feathers flock together.
Didn’t you know that most of the developed countries have already accepted the industry of Network Marketing? Don’t believe me? Just look at Japan, China, US, Singapore, Hong Kong, Malaysia, any many more. I think these countries are not that stupid to be just “persuaded”, “napilit”, or “naloko” ng friends nila, but rather I think they saw a REAL business in it.
And PLEASE, if you are not running your own business or did not even had the courage of thinking about it. Don’t even bother posting your opinions about “business” because it will just eat and waste space on this page. How can someone who is an employee all their life understand how business works? Look at it this way, its is just like driving a mere Honda for your lifetime and then giving comments on how it feels to drive a Bentley.
Just so you know, the so famous Franchising industry that is very accepted and most of the entrepreneurs are crazy about today was nearly banned in the US decades ago? That is the same scenario that I see happening on the Network Marketing industry, maybe it is ridiculed today by the “employee mindset” Filipino masses but give it 5 years or a decade and it will be as accepted as the other industries, how am i so sure? Because as what I’ve mentioned it is already widely accepted on the developed countries and being a 3rd world nation that we are, we always see and realize opportunities LAST, which is very sad.
God gave you a brain and the intellect to understand things, don’t let other people’s opinion/s decide for you. Use your head, be open-minded and decide when you really understand it already, the last thing that a misinformed nation needs is a comment from a confident, closed-minded and misinformed individual.
God bless to all.
Before you come to the defense of MLMs, I did not say I disagreed with the concept of MLMs. It works for many people. Otherwise, it wouldn’t exist. However, like anyone who attended the meeting, I do have the right to share my observations and my experience. It is my blog after all.
Re-read the post again, Mario. Whereas I do not disagree on the business model, I did not like how the MLM concept was pitched to us new recruits. It’s not WHO or WHAT, but rather HOW. And it’s in the HOW that MLM organizations get all the flack. Why?
1) There was a lot of shrouded secrecy and mystery that happens behind the scenes. A script? A sales pitch that’s masked as a coffee date? We love our friends but we tired of being manipulated as puppets. If you want to talk to us about Nu Skin, then be direct about it. Set up a meeting at my office. But to remain opaque when I ask you about your job, well, thats another story.
2) Yes, there is pressure when you attend a BOM. Less compared to before I heard, but the pressure still exists. How do you explain having new recruits sit in front, while the old distributors sit in the back? Or making sure you talk to your recruiter friend on a one-on-one basis after the presentation? Yes, we can leave but it won’t be easy for us to do so. Which is why you’re BOMs are structured that way.
Still don’t believe me? What if you want to get out of MLM? As per other commenter’s experiences above, it’s not easy to get out of MLM. If this is how you talk to me and you’re just reading my blog, imagine the conversation if you’re talking to a person and trying to dissuade them from leaving your organization?
3) Yes, I am running my own business. So? Does it make me better than people who are employees? Mario, without employees, business are nothing Please give them proper respect. There is nothing wrong in being an employee. And honestly, some employees make good money. When I was working in a bank, I was already earning hundreds of thousands. Not bad. Like I mentioned before, it may sometimes be better to be an employee with a good income than to work in your own business. More stable. And yes, I’ve literally driven both a Honda and a Bentley.
4) The MLM industry has been in existence since the 1920s! And it still gets the same flack. Only when the MLM people be more open as to why there are so many criticisms about them that they can fix themselves and stop doing what people hate. Only then can they be more widely accepted.
But if every time the MLM industry gets criticized and the distributors gets defensive, lashing out their claws, and insult/badmouth/bitch about anyone who don’t agree, more and more people will get turned off from MLM. Nobody wants to work with bullies. And being eloquent and using highfalutin words talking about 3rd world countries and progress do not hide the fact that you are indeed a bully.
Hilarious! This is one of the main reasons I left the industry. For a short period in my life, I was just like you… spewing nonsense about others being close-minded to my ideas, while I was being close-minded to others’ ideas. Quite hypocritical, don’t you think?
Whoopsie! I have to clarify that I was addressing Mario’s hypocrisy. 😀
And to add, almost everything Mario said is also part of the brainwashing script used in “closing” skeptical prospects.
The default move is to attack the “employee mindset” of the prospect, make him feel stupid, make him feel sorry for himself for being a loser who is blind to such an amazing opportunity.
To this day, I still feel the intense shame of uttering so much judgmental garbage back in the day. Yuck! I need to take another bath now!
LMAO Mario got owned.
On the Nu Skin issue, I was invited by the former president of my organization (I’ve never talked to her before) to join. She talked about a “great business opportunity”, and I found it really weird that she trusted me well enough to invite me over to partake in this “opportunity” even though she didn’t really know me all that well. Sooo there, a couple of hours in their Pearl Drive building, and I came out convinced. Maybe I’m just that gullible. Haha
I’d have to admit, their brainwashing scheme was pretty good; it took a one-hour conversation with my family at home before I shook off the whole idea of getting rich quick through MLM.
A couple more people tried to invite me in the next few months, with the same vague language and random timing everyone here’s been talking about. Never again. lol
Totally agree with the author. These pyramid-scheme people are straight out of a cult.
Please ask yourself these questions:
If NuSkin people actually said on the call/invitation that he/she is from NuSkin or network marketing or MLM, do you think they would be able to have guests? With all the pyramiding scams here in the Phils, legit MLM companies suffered big time. A lot of people now think negative things with legit MLM companies. So having the negative image (it doesn’t deserve), if a NuSkin person actually tells you on the phone, that you’re gonna be attending a business seminar regarding network marketing, do you actually think people will still come. I’ve attended one of their seminars obviously. It was really interesting. And my friend invited me clearly. He said and I quote, ” …this is not a job offer though but a business project. Basically a one-time and non-committal appointment lang so you can assess if you can do it.” That’s crystal clear to me. (I was invited a few weeks ago so I can still recall his script.)
Did they actually say that it is a “easy get-rich scheme”? Because the speaker on the seminar I attended (a young Blue Diamond from DLSU), actually said that WORKING HARD is a requirement, that working hard is the “only catch”. So how is that a “easy get-rich scheme”? I don’t know if it was Dennis Ong’s fault if you misinterpreted him though…
P.S.
PLEASE WATCH THE EPISODE ON DISCOVERY CHANNEL WHEN THEY FEATURED NUSKIN’S TECHNOLOGY AGAIN. Yes, the name NuSkin was never mentioned but the scientists and products that were featured were from NuSkin. It was like featuring a big happy bee making delicious chickens without actually mentioning the words chickenjoy or jollibee.
🙂
First, how is it similar to a “pyramid scheme” when you don’t get a cut from your downlines? The company gives bonuses to you. The only thing you have to pay for is the initial products you have to try.
You could compare it to a taxi business. Think about it. Yes, for drivers to “be hired” or “join” a taxi company, they don’t really need to pay for anything. But EVERY DAY that they drive the taxi, there’s this thing called BOUNDARY that they have to pay to their “employer.” I think that’s around ~1k-2k per day? Yes, they get what’s left of their “sales”, but what happens if they don’t get any customers for the day? If you’re saying that being in an MLM business is “being greedy”, personally think those taxi / bus / jeepney businesses seem to be greedier. But from a taxi driver standpoint, that’s a way for them to earn money, right? It’s MUTUALISM.
That’s how it is in Nu Skin. MUTUALISM. If you don’t want to be a part of it, it’s fine, just say so. We’re only calling so we can sift and look for those people who have the same mindset. But please DO NOT GENERALIZE. I’m sorry that your experience was like that, but just so you know, not all distributors “invite” that way. I hope that’s clear.
Second, I would personally compare a Nu Skin business similar to how FRANCHISE businesses work. We distribute Nu Skin products much in the same way as how 7-Elevens, Ministops, Puregold, Mercury Drug, etc distribute products from P&G. What’s the difference? Why do we “recruit”? Because Nu Skin can’t really train a whole lot of distributors from all over the world, so we do the job of looking for other people to train to become effective distributors to their target market, and in turn get “royalty” (w/c are actually bonuses) from Nu Skin. It’s like branching out and expanding, much in the same way that McDonald’s and other fastfood chains are everywhere, because each branch caters to a different market (depending on location).
Also, on another note, if you’re familiar with the path each product out in the traditional market goes through (manufacturer, supplier, distributor, delivery, etc), you’d be surprised at how much the SRP differs from the actual cost. I read that you’re a businesswoman yourself. I hope you equip yourself with proper knowledge about network marketing / direct sales.
Third, we (at least the people that I’ve heard) never claim that it’s easy. We always emphasize that it takes HARD WORK and EFFORT to be successful in this business, just like in any undertaking.
Lastly, please don’t generalize.
Nu Skin is not for everyone, but it is indeed for those who wish to perform at 10000% and get 10000% in return (unlike in jobs with a cap in salary).
And please do proper research. If you researched well enough, you’d figure out that the scientists featured in that Discovery Channel clip are the same scientists who spearheaded Nu Skin’s anti-aging products. I think “LifeGen Technologies” is indicated in the clip. LifeGen was bought by Nu Skin. Please please before you make conclusions and act like you know what you’re talking about, make sure you’re well-researched. I understand that your blog is subjective and about your experience. But when it comes to the actual facts, please don’t mess them up.
i guess bonita( nameless author) has to make money writing negative blogs. and blogs are the most unreliable source of information based on opinions of people who may or may not be qualified. nor credible.
how can you trust the opinion of someone nameless?
how can you trust someone’s opinion or definition about passive income, when she-bonita( the nameless author ) admits not having experiencing it?
and to say that income from real estate is not passive income is to negate the very creator of the word passive income itself! even getting your money from the bank is effort. so by your shallow and narrow definition, even interest income is not passive income.
you may have driven a bentley( which i doubt), but you certainly do not have the sense of someone who owns one. you sound like someone who doesn’t have traditional business experience from the way you sound. kase masyadong petty yung mga complaints mo.
when a call center agent calls you to sell to you, they are not friends of yours. when a friend has coffee with you and asks you whats new with you, and shares whats new with them. and a project, whats wrong with that? if you are not interested, you do not have to say yes. and when you are not interested, why did you meet them the second time? aren’t you the one being deceitful to your friend? and wasting their time? just so you can write a negative blog about your friend? you are a back biter and a hypocrite.
just because you do not agree with the way people do business, it doesn’t make them wrong. its just you. like i said, i’m not talking about the difference between the approach of a call center and network marketing. i’m simply saying, i do not like their way of doing things as well, but it doesn’t make them a bad business. every business has their own way of doing things, you may or may not like it. just as i don’t like people making money from negative news or blogs that are unproductive nor helpful. but it doesn’t mean its not a good business.
by the way you sound. it seems that you are saying everyone who sells to their friends at any time is committing a crime. since when is selling an idea or an item a crime? what is a crime is when you paint a bad picture of a friend behind their back because you do not have the balls to own up and say it to them in front. or is it because you are guilty, because in fact, nobody pressured you to do anything. or is it because you are not intellectually confident enough about your viewpoints.
my reaction to your blog is because of your narrow minded viewpoints. such is the reason i’m certain your bank account is equally unimpressive . and your claims otherwise, has yet to be proven. but i’m sure the reason why you need to write this blog nor have the time to write negative nothings, shallow opinions like this can only mean that your time is cheap. super cheap.
but of course your opinion and my opinion will always be different, as i’m sure our bank accounts are. like what you have said. you have never experienced passive income. sorry but there are alot of us who have been enjoying them from our owning real estate, dividends from our shares, and paper assets. please do not hate us just because you are poor and do not even think you are capable of doing it. the fact that you say 30,000,000 is not enough to create passive income because YOUR definition of passive income only pertains to interest in the bank. you should not have used that terminology. you should have said INTEREST Income.. not passive income dear.. you sound rather ignorant of the term you are using. simply put, your business opinions are poorer than your ability to write. which is probably why you are a blogger. instead of a business owner. a blogger sells negative news to get attention from losers, while business owners concentrate on selling something of value to gain profit.and again you say you are a business owner? its questionable.
your poor business logic belies this. unless your parents are business owners, or your husband. not you. 🙂
get off your high horse, sam lee!
wanna join me on the horse lam see? 🙂 its nice up here. you should try it
Hell, no!
Sam, Re-read my comments again.
Let me repeat: I know and am already experiencing exactly what passive income is, by your definition AND mine.
I don’t make money off my blog. I wish! Where did you get that idea?
Your comment is negative. And yet you spend a lot of time writing them on my blog. Thanks for spending a lot of time leaving a lot of these comments. It gives everyone else a lot more insight about what type of people Nu Skin supporters are like. So thanks!
And yes, I am a business owner. My parents are both business owners. My husband has his own business. His parents are business owners. And I also have mine. It’s not big but it’s growing. Quite well too. And I’m excited to be working at my business day in and out. My people are proud to say they’re part of my team.
Anyway, I don’t have to show you my SEC or DTI papers to prove I have a business. I don’t need to show you my bank account just to say I have money. What for? You will always insist my bank account is unimpressive, my credentials questionable and my business sense flawed. Then again, that’s what makes blogging fun. I’m enjoying reading your comments. I don’t whether I should take them seriously or not, but they sure are amusing. Keep ’em coming!
if your definition of a business is to do something without paying anything. how shallow is that? if i have a hardware store , how do i sell something if i don’t even shell out the money to rent and renovate a space to call it a hardware? if i have a furniture business, how can i even call it that if i don’t even have money to buy wood and pay for labor to make furniture?
when people pitch their business plan to solicit an unsecured investment from you, thats not the ONLY way one can do business.
why not try to ask jollibee to tell you all the insider things about their business without paying them a franchise fees? do you see how ridiculous your arguments and narrow your opinions are?
and isn’t telling you in person transparent enough? its an opportunity for you to say yes or no.and what if people are not willing to do business over the phone? or email? is that wrong? because they have their right to show the business details to whomever they are willing to say it to. and if you were free to get out of the room without them chasing after you, and in fact you were attending their meetings with a big group where they may not even notice you coming or going, how is that pressure?? 🙂 talk about over reacting. what you think is right or wrong is based on your own interpretation as i am also entitled to my interpretation of your words, your opinions, and your argument. and as of the moment, i see it as narrow, shallow, negative, and non credible. that’s just my opinion. sorry nothing personal. im just stating my opinion about your written opinion and argument , and i’m also entitled to my opinion of your blog.
Of course you can leave your opinion. Haven’t you noticed? I just allow you to keep commenting negative comments on and on instead of deleting them which is my right…? 🙂
You’re rambling now though. Almost everything you mentioned above, I never even written about. I never defined business the way you wrote above. What about jollibee sharing insider information? Or franchising? Where are you getting all of this?
Sam, you are rambling and straying away from the topic, which is MLMs. Stay within the topic. What exactly are you trying to say?
Hmn.. a couple of observations.
1. Those who are commenting against this post are either (or both):
a. Nu Skin recruits, or whatever else they call themselves
b. Don’t really understand the blogger’s main point, which she keeps reiterating in her replies (it’s the HOW it was done people, plain and simple)
2. Her blog, her experience, her observations ..to share when she wants.
Also, thanks to Bonita for sharing. Isa lamang po akong empleyado noong pumatol sa 11k trio package ng isang MLM company, thinking it was an easy way to get money. I ended up losing a close friend whom I succeeded in recruiting because (like what usually happens) our upline/s lost support for us AFTER the recruitment process.
MLM is not for the fainthearted. And is definitely not a get rich easy scheme like “recruiters” make it out to be. Lesson learned the hard way. 🙁
If the blogger’s main point really was about the “HOW”, then she should have stopped at that. I understand her concern, that she felt cheated because she was invited the wrong way (and I agree that how her friend did it was wrong). But if that’s the case that only the “HOW” was her main point, she should have just focused on that, instead of misleading some of her readers with false facts and hasty generalizations. Just hope she could straighten out some of the facts.
About your 11k package in a certain “MLM company”, the problem in the Philippines is that a lot of “MLM companies” are popping up, and some of them are actually pyramiding companies that disguise themselves as MLM.
A legit MLM company is part of the DSAP (Direct Selling Association of the Philippines). You can check their website for the legit ones. Natasha, Avon, Boardwalk, Dakki, even Tupperware, are all LEGIT MLM companies, just like Nu Skin.
Sorry that you had to go through that experience with your “uplines”, but I think you can’t blame the whole MLM industry for the mistake of a couple of rotten other “MLM companies.” And most certainly, you can’t generalize that all MLMs are like that just because your experience with a certain company was like that. I think the company you joined is a pyramiding scheme where the main source of profit is your “joining fee.” That’s not the case with Nu Skin. “Uplines” never leave support for their partners after “recruitment” because that’s not the point of the business. We don’t just “recruit” to earn money. We recruit partners so we can expand our market, so we help them find their customer base (much like how Starbucks and McDonalds in certain places get loyal customers), until they can start making it on their own.
Another thing, Nu Skin makes it clear that it’s not a get rich easy scheme, and that it takes a large amount of effort to be successful.
Sometimes people just don’t understand everything when they see the business, and I can’t really blame them. What’s not acceptable though is when people make conclusions about things that they don’t fully understand, and haven’t even conducted research about.
“and you ask them to sell Nu Skin products with you, with you the recruiter getting a cut on their sales. ” <- This line is misleading. When you say "a cut", it means you're deducting something from their profit / sales. That is not the case with Nu Skin. Nothing gets deducted from your profit / sales, except TAXES. Yes, WE PAY FOR TAXES. 🙂 Could you please fix your post to accommodate the actual FACTS?
Please, please, please get your facts straight before posting! Some of the stuff you mentioned are really misleading!! And it's ironic that *you* are complaining about your friend misleading you.
I respect the fact that you're posting about your own personal experience about being invited and that your writing is your OPINION, and frankly, I do understand where you're coming from. I think that you were really invited the wrong way, and that is probably why you feel cheated. I get you. But please DO NOT GENERALIZE because not all of us are like that. I was invited before not "for coffee" but for a business project.
Bottomline, you can rant and write your opinion all you want based on your own perspective, but please don't mislead your readers with false information. I hope you could straighten out your facts.
1) Paola, I stand firm on my statement. You are arguing about language and semantics. But you are NOT getting the point.
I did not say the cut comes from their salary. But every time one of your down line sells, you get a 5-10% commission depending on whether you recruited them or one of your down lines recruited them. This commission is paid to you online. This is written extensively at the official Nu Skin site. I even forwarded people to the official Nu skin compensation package link in my post which states clearly how people get rewarded.
Paola, this is what a cut means. If you want to talk about semantics, it means you get a piece of the pie. You get profit from the efforts of others. This is not misleading. It is ENGLISH.
It is only you who is assuming the cut means binabawasan yung cut sa benta mo. Don’t put words in my mouth. I did not mention this.
2) Now, only you assume the cut means you get profit from people’s own sales, you are once again putting words in my mouth and trying to mislead readers with your bullying comments.
Case in point, who is mentioning about taxes? My gosh Paola. Can you please READ? I never mentioned that Nu Skin distributors don’t pay taxes?! Where the hell did that come from?
3) I am not generalizing. Other people who have been kind enough to comment have also shared their experiences on how they were being recruited at Nu Skin. Our experiences are similar: it’s the same script, the same catch up date, the same presentation in Ortigas, the same one-on-one session with our “friend” who want to ask us to join them in this business opportunity.
This is not a generalization. This is what is happening. And we experience the same thing because it’s the same formulaic script that’s being followed since 15 years ago, according to OldSkin, who was an ex-distributor.
Call it business project but not coffee. Call it BOM but not sales pitch. Call it whatever you want to call it but not a script.
If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, Paola, IT’S A FREAKING DUCK!
P.S. And just in case you will once again accuse me of calling you a duck, I am not. There is nothing wrong in being a duck though.
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>
“trying to mislead readers with your bullying comments” <- Please define bullying.
According to Wikipedia: "Bullying is the use of force, threat, or coercion to abuse, intimidate, or aggressively dominate others"
According to Merriam-Webster: "1: to treat abusively
2: to affect by means of force or coercion"
I don't get how I bullied you, when I just called out on you to straighten some facts?
I didn't put words in your mouth. I just merely pointed out how it can be misleading! Oh my gosh, Bonita. 🙂
About the taxes, my bad. It turns out it's from one of the commenters. But I never said that you claimed anything about taxes, though. If you want to take things literally, then that's my argument. I never said that you said anything about taxes 😉 But yes, admitting my lapse there. 🙂
About #3, yes, you are generalizing. Again, according to Merriam-Webster:
"Generalization – a general statement : a statement about a group of people or things that is based on only a few people or things in that group
: the act or process of forming opinions that are based on a small amount of information"
You have to understand that there are different teams in Nu Skin, just like in any organization, for that matter. The mistake of some is never the mistake of all. We don't "invite for coffee," at least me and people in my team. You only know a handful of experiences, it's not enough to generalize. 🙂
"If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, Paola, IT’S A FREAKING DUCK!" <- How about a human *acting like a duck*? 🙂 Haha sorry I just really don't get what's your point there.
Once again, you're generalizing. Sorry talaga haha I'm in the sciences field and we know for a fact that we can't make conclusions just based on 1 observation. We have to gather A LOT of data and conduct numerous experiments to come up with a conclusion. I guess this is why I find fault in your way of coming up with conclusions without proper research process 🙂
I'm merely trying to raise a few points here, Bonita! Please don't get offended and again accuse me of bullying you! Stop acting lik the victim, I really don't get how my comments come across as "bullying" 🙂
whats wrong with getting a cut? or this is just semantics to mean ” profit”?? bonita must be so ignorant of business not to know that when any product goes from the manufacturer to the consummer, MANY LAYERS get a cut! nobody works for free these days. the vice president of ayala land, gets a “cut” from his unit managers, who gets a cut from their agents, who gets a cut from their buyers, and ultimately,even the driver of ayala land’s salary is partially from the sales of ayala land! duh!
Honestly I was so pissed with the scheme, same ploy a friend of mine who wasn’t even an employee of Nu-skin at the time, acted like a middle man recruiter for the real recruiter. But its totally the same set up, i didn’t receive a call, i just met my friend at Shangrila one weekend, and he was like so how’s life and all, then the conversation segued to have you thought about investing, or exploring options to multiply your savings or income, then are you free today, Actually i have an appointment with an “investment firm” if you are free today, it starts at 5:30, honestly i was so enticed because at the time i taught it was a job or investment opportunity, so we went to ortigas, at the 20 something floor of Octagon Center, and there was I surprised to see a crowd of people, and in the corners are beauty products and all, but it was really deceptive as there was not even a sign that says “NU SKIN” i found out only after that deceptive orientation. Honestly i was turned off by the whole Pyramiding hocus pocus, and i was more turned off with the price of their products, I mean its priced at 24K to 70K and you have to invest and sell those products without a guarantee that it even works. But what ticked me the most is their gadgets, their so called biometer scale of sorts, they where demoing it to me, trying to measure my bio stats, but the gadgets where an utter failure, at that point i only got pissed because, they where like saying that i am already past the red mark, so the machine cannot read me. Wow, they even told that while a lot of people where there talking of embarrassment. At that point I got really pissed, civil in front of those bogus machinations to entice me to invest, but with what i got, an utter waste of my time, nonsensical entrepreneurial strategy, deceptive campaigning, and that embarrassing incident. I told them politely i have to think of it first because i have to make sure every cent or penny counts on my investment, i know business is a huge risk, but i have to know the company before, i commit because unlike those who where totally convinced after the orientation of sorts, I told them that the presentation is not enough to convince me to invest, second as an investor I want to enter into a venture where i am the sole proprietor, not the networking, pyramiding scheme, where i invest, then i recruit two more or so to invest and vice versa. I told my friend nicely that well i have to think about it, kasi i dont think the company is credible enough to entice me to invest, Second the moment i Knew it was a network marketing business i kind of found it risky, because of such companies like G. Cosmos and other pyramiding schemes which entices vulnerable investors, then the mother company would pull out the stocks leading the company to bankruptcy, and lost investments. Honestly i have nothing against NU-skin, but what i find wrong is their machination and schemes that are very deceptive. If truly they want to be a legitimate business they should be honest, open and transparent from the beginning. In my experience its all the opposite, very exclusive, secretive and deceptive.
Reblogged this on Safe Haven and commented:
Nu Skin Nuisance
What a pity to hear about your experience. I’m a NuSkin distributor myself and your friend seems to have messed up her script (yes, there is a script!). If you read it, it says you’re just supposed to be direct to the point and ask if the person’s open to seeing a business, details to follow when we meet etc etc.. Yeah you do pay the person a compliment but no one said you have to go too far. It could be as simple as “kasi kilala kita” or “I like working with you”. Something reassuring but subtle to the friend. You’re supposed to keep them interested and curious, but not to the point of being shady, so the caller just has to give enough info but not too much. I do have a problem with not saying the name though, so I say it when people ask (hello, transparency! Don’t tell my up lines haha). If they’re open to it, great. If not, that’s cool too. Walang basagan ng trip. I’m sad to hear though that your friend lured you in through coffee (isumbong sa upline!) when that’s not supposed to happen. It gives us hardworking, transparent MLMers a bad name.
And just a comment on the product training you mentioned at the end, NuSkin actually does have brilliant product training. It’s just that the Business Opportunity Meetings are supposed to share with you an overview of the products + model + compensation. For more info, ask the distributor who invited you. If it’s not your thing, thanks for your time!
Hi lulu! may you become a blue diamond soon! 3 years or 3 decades, as long as you work the plan right? it’s just a numbers game. if people don’t join you, their loss not yours.
or you can follow old skin and work for 3 decades and hopefully get a gold watch from a company and call himself noble because he never sold anything in his life.
its always a numbers game when you do business, since when did a restaurant make money without numbers, since when did websites make money without more hits, since when did newspapers make money without having more numbers. business = numbers old skin 🙂 di ka lang siguro bagay sa business, mas bagay ka to be someone’s employee mas noble yun 🙂
Huh? You’re making a lot of assumptions again Sam. You don’t even know where Oldskin is doing. You assume he is poor and unsuccessful. And that he doesn’t know anything about numbers. That he never sold anything in his life.
I bet Oldskin is laughing reading your comments. I think he has a good sense of humor. I know I am… 🙂
gawd aside from NuSkin, FrontRow got me too =_= i know those products are legit naman. heck they’re selling eh. pero i just hate the fact that the agents lie. lalo na kung close friend mo pa sa college. can’t you like just get straight to the point already. haha. really nice article. my friend was a victim something like this (sa ortigas din, idk if NuSkin too) and she had a really bad experience (pati sa pagpunta) and the agent/ friend she was with was only focusing on the greed part and not for her safety. kainis!
i think its this blogger bullying her poor friend who did nothing except to show her an option. she had the ability to say no, but she pretended to be interested and even went to a presentation. and once again had an option to say no and seems like her friend never pestered her nor forced her to do anything. but i guess she deceived her friend and is using this blog to bully her and throw stones at her back. i just hate these types of hypocrites like this nameless in taipei who is a bloodsucking vendor of negativity who is willing to sell her soul and friendship for spare change. whos obvious reasoning can only come from someone who does not have solid business experience because the arguments are so vain and stupid. too many holes to punch in this writes arguments.
i pity her friend patricia and it’s good riddance for her to lose these type of garbage friends. friends do not backbite their friends this way for no serious thing they did to you except show you an option without pressuring you. if my friend sold me a business, insurance whatever, or just wanted my opinion on something, i see no wrong to take a look and just tell her my 2 cents. its just a cup of coffee for goodness sakes. chill. its no big deal. the poor thing just probably wanted to share her business or products. whats wrong with that? you can always say no. its simple noh?
few observations of this writer- nameless bonita in taipei based on her arguments:
1- she does not really understand what passive income means. but pretends to do so.
2- she pretends to know what she does not know and looks like a fool to people who know the real deal. read the books of kiyosaki instead of just quoting a few words you’ve heard somewhere so you can have a more intelligent argument.
3-she is one of those naive people who think that one shouldn’t make money in business. whenever anything is sold in the supermarket, or anywhere, the person at the top ( owner of supermarket), the distributor, the agent who sold to the supermarket gets a ” cut” is thats wrong, then let’s do something else. but don’t do business. how simple is this not to understand?nothing in this world gets passed on to someone without a profit you poor bonita. you are just not used to knowing and receiving a ” cut” as you are only used to being a buyer instead of a business owner. because if you really have a business, you would know that you get a cut of anything that gets sold whatever it is you sell through people , agents, or your store.
4- she is opinionated and wants to dictate how a friend should talk to a friend, what can be said and what cannot be said. you should have forewarned your friends ” must ask my permission first what to discuss over coffee” . i wonder if you really have friends.
5-she is not straightforward and is not confident enough to shoot from the front, but instead has questionable integrity to deceive a friend , wasting her time pretending to be interested,and play her so she can backbite her and hopefully get her blog noticed writing negative things about her friend at the expense of a friend who did nothing but show her options. typical pinoy crab, siguro pag nasa america ito, si nameless itong traidor na nagbebenta ng kaibigan na TNT to make a buck.
6- pretentious. you call yourself a business owner when your arguments , can only come from a naive person who’s never had any real business. you are a disgrace to the business community. you don’t even know how to make 100,000 passive income from 30,000,000 pesos??? how stupid can you be? even my driver knows how to buy “paupahan” to make more than that.only a fool without business experience will put her 30,000,000 to make 1.2% or whatever pathetic interest from the bank. any simple person knows that buying a jollibee at that price can make at least 500,000/month.
7- your arguments and points are so shallow and narrow and frankly, old news. its repetition of same points that aren’t valid on a business point of view. its opinion vs facts. its actually, ill researched, and grossly inaccurate. just like what another person said above. you call them deceitful for mentioning discovery channel when in fact, they were telling the truth. it is you whos mouth precedes your facts. opinionated and loud without being careful of your information. in short, parang tsismosang housewife without any sensible thing to do than to gossip.
8- don’t write about something you are not good at. better stick to gossip and people. as you seem to be really good at talking about other people as small people do. because big people don’t have time for such petty things as talking about other people behind their backs . over reacting over nothing. i hope one day someone will do the same thing to you so you will know how your friend will feel after she finds out how you backstabbed and bullied her behind her back.
Erin, there is a big difference between companies that have something to sell like amway, herbalife, nuskin. avon, vs those scams like frontrow, aim global, royale, UNO who’s products are just an excuse for a scheme.
in amway, nuskin, what you pay for has an equivalent product, do you get value for value. typical as you buy a perfume in rustans. you get something worth the money you bought.
in frontrow ,UNO, if you paid in ,and calculated the stuff you got, you would find you got dupped! your money just shrunk in value.say you paid 10,000. you probably got less than 1000 in real value. so even if you sell all the contents. it’s not worth the money you paid. so you need to con others to pay-in to their scheme to get even.
in legit network marketing companies, if you sell all your products you paid for, you get back your money fully, and there’s normally a good refund policy to protect consumers, which is why i think these businesses are relatively risk free , its quite a smart concept actually, unless you are one of those allergic to making money and sales.
most binary companies in the philippines are a scam save for usana, which has mediocre run of the mill products endorsed by a book written by their own people(pretending to be a doctor) to say usana has the best products.
i may not be into networking, but at least know enough to separate the scam from the real deal. unlike some of these wannabes who wrote these blogs who don’t even know the basics.
these writers would be better off exposing those scams rather than prey on legitimate opportunities that sell a real product. scams like UNO who get underage kids to pawn their stuff to get into the deal and offers no amount of consumer protection. no refund policies etc. because there is nothing to refund. the products they bought were not worth the money they paid.
network marketing maybe a great opportunity for people who neither have the capital nor the business experience. its the scams like UNO , aim global, and other binaries that hurt the chances of small people who want to earn an honest living selling a legitimate product or business. my friend survived yolanda from tacloban came to manila to help her parents back home repair the damage and get back on their feet, thankfully, someone taught her how to sell nuskin products. she makes over 100k a month selling the products and sending money home to help her family. kudos to her.i would even give her clients to help her because she’s making an honest living. and trying her best.
lets not be so negative . it’s just sales. everyone has to make money. basta its a legitimate deal not a scam i have no problem with that. sorry guys, i just hate these kinds of backdoor bullying by these types of anonymous bloggers that sell their soul and their friends to vend negativity for spare change blogging.
I experienced this not long time ago… A college friend called me one night and asking me how am I doing… Then suddenly her tone became so serious and it’s like she is memorizing her line… I’m sorry but I burst into laughing and said to her “hey ako ito… Ano ka ba… But she kept her serious line like let’s have coffee and I’ll tell you ano ang pinagbibisihan ko. Well I know naman what’s her up to kaya sabi ko I’m bc… But the thing is.. Parang nagging robot ang agent sa script nila. Hehehe sorry I guess I’m not an”open minded person” na sabi nila… For me parang kulto ang dating… Pero kung kumikita and their happy with what they are doing… Then let them be… Wag lang Sana ganun yun approach… Nakaka**go e.. Hehehe
Bonita, iha, you are so ignorant. You clearly did not understand the whole thing. You just did not get it. You prejudged it prematurely. I would like to comment on so many things that you have said, but I realize I’m just wasting my time because you have already made up your mind. You did not know what you said no to. Nuskin is not for everyone. It’s definitely not for you.
Come back after you become a Team Elite member, Shannah, you arrogant _____.
you a cult member, ma’am
This is sad.. Dear Bonita, you don’t have to defend anything to them. There’s a reason why you posted this on a blog – to express your personal opinion 🙂 It is frustrating that some people may have misunderstood what you meant with the post and that they should have to accept that not everyone thinks the way they do.
Pro Nu Skin – 4
Anti Nu Skin – 26
Ding ding ding.
So I suppose all 26 of these people went to the twilight zone instead of emerging more enlightened and free to pursue their dreams of making millions from Nu Skin’s “training”
Don’t mind this Sam Lee person… I AM THE REAL SAM LEE!
NU SKIN AND ALL OTHER MLM GROUPS ARE A BUNCH OF MONEY-OBSESSED CULT MEMBERS
Stop the hate! Let everyone do their own thing! Sharing with you an article that can make your eyes open about MLM marketing but if it’s not your thing, then it’s still cool! Basta, tama na all the bashing. Wala naman yan magagawa. 🙂
http://www.forbes.com/sites/robertlaura/2014/08/29/would-you-join-a-multi-level-marketing-company-for-retirement-income/